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Money! Questions do you have the answers????

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1default Money! Questions do you have the answers???? on Fri Jun 22, 2007 9:36 pm

Pamela

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I am currently reading a book that has a premise on money and becoming rich God's way...I have turned some of the sentences into questions to see how we all look at money...Does God want His people to stay poor? I don't think He does...I read in the bible and then the properity was in cattle, sheep and materials, not really money based....I read somewhere but can't recall right now, that Jesus didn't even touch money, not once, while He walked the earth...I have never checked that out, but I can remember reading it...

There is a taboo when it comes to money...I was listening to Suzy Orman a while ago. She was saying that no one likes to talk openly about their money....It was her opinion that we should be open with it, but I don't know where I stand on that...She of course makes millions and of all certainity can boast...But as Christians we are called NOT to be boastful...though I do agree there is a taboo when it comes to money...

Just to mention that some of what I will be typing will be quotes from the book I am reading, but not direct quotes, I will type it in my understanding and will pose some questions that they don't ask, but only use as sentences....This way I am not plagerizing and I can still get my points across...

This topic has had me puzzled for some time...Does God want us to be rich or does He not? I keep going back and forth on this issue...

Money is not evil, but being a slave to money is....Most people become a slave to money, allowing it to dictate the limits of their lives..

Money does not corrupt you...Money can only reveal to you who you really are....If you are greedy at the core, more money will only make you greedier.....If you are cheap, more money will only make you cheapier....If you are a crook, more money will only make you more of a crook....If you are generous, more money will make you even more generous...If you are poor, more money will only make you poorer, (which are why most lottery winners are soon broke.) If you are a fool, more money will only make you a bigger fool...If you are a master of your money, your money will grow and prosper yourself as well as those around you because your money is doing God's work....
(Quoted from Robert T. Kiyosaki forward)

The question is: How do I use my labor and my money to do God's work?

Can you become rich without selling your soul?

Has the church failed in teaching how to prosper even though they preach prospering? In my opinion YES! I have been saying this for years now...

http://awtj.webs.com

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Pamela wrote:I am currently reading a book that has a premise on money and becoming rich God's way...I have turned some of the sentences into questions to see how we all look at money...Does God want His people to stay poor? I don't think He does...I read in the bible and then the properity was in cattle, sheep and materials, not really money based....I read somewhere but can't recall right now, that Jesus didn't even touch money, not once, while He walked the earth...I have never checked that out, but I can remember reading it...

There is a taboo when it comes to money...I was listening to Suzy Orman a while ago. She was saying that no one likes to talk openly about their money....It was her opinion that we should be open with it, but I don't know where I stand on that...She of course makes millions and of all certainity can boast...But as Christians we are called NOT to be boastful...though I do agree there is a taboo when it comes to money...

Just to mention that some of what I will be typing will be quotes from the book I am reading, but not direct quotes, I will type it in my understanding and will pose some questions that they don't ask, but only use as sentences....This way I am not plagerizing and I can still get my points across...

This topic has had me puzzled for some time...Does God want us to be rich or does He not? I keep going back and forth on this issue...

Money is not evil, but being a slave to money is....Most people become a slave to money, allowing it to dictate the limits of their lives..

Money does not corrupt you...Money can only reveal to you who you really are....If you are greedy at the core, more money will only make you greedier.....If you are cheap, more money will only make you cheapier....If you are a crook, more money will only make you more of a crook....If you are generous, more money will make you even more generous...If you are poor, more money will only make you poorer, (which are why most lottery winners are soon broke.) If you are a fool, more money will only make you a bigger fool...If you are a master of your money, your money will grow and prosper yourself as well as those around you because your money is doing God's work....
(Quoted from Robert T. Kiyosaki forward)

The question is: How do I use my labor and my money to do God's work?

Can you become rich without selling your soul?

Has the church failed in teaching how to prosper even though they preach prospering? In my opinion YES! I have been saying this for years now...
Poverty does not serve or glorify God...consider there is no one with more possesions than God (Ps 24:1) and that God divides these things unto men...Luk 15:31 And he said unto him, Son, thou art ever with me, and all that I have is thine.

It is defined in scripture in many places what the will of the Lord is towards prosperity....it begins with prosperity of soul...3Jo 1:2 Beloved, I wish above all things that thou mayest prosper and be in health, even as thy soul prospereth. When John is saying this it is God saying it...that is what scriptures are for...God speaking through the inspiration given to men.

The book of Phillipians was Paul's letter to a giving people. Financial issues are based firstly upon giving. You have to sow in order to reap in any area of life as God works on the seed principal in the natural order and also in the spiritual order. People who do not give can never prosper and keep it because the word is sure about that... Pro 11:24 There is that scattereth, and yet increaseth; and [there is] that withholdeth more than is meet, but [it tendeth] to poverty. The principles that you lay out on the negatives of money are all true...but that does not preclude the effectual use of finances to forward the lives of believers nor is it a deal breaker to want money as long as it serves the duality of purpose that the gospel be promulgated and the believer has a goodly inheritance. Prosperity is a good thing...Psa 35:27 Let them shout for joy, and be glad, that favour my righteous cause: yea, let them say continually, Let the LORD be magnified, which hath pleasure in the prosperity of his servant.

My spiritual initiative is centred upon these things because God has planted it in me...

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Hi Pamela, I am glad you brought up how Jesus never touched money. I believe the reason that was so because money is the mark of the beast, and of course Christ would not take the mark of the beast.

Do I fear then that I will suffer eternal damnation for it? No, for Christ did say everyone, slave free, rich or poor will receive the mark of the beast and will not be able to buy or sell without it. Pretty much sounds like money to me, as currency also bears a seal or a mark to represent the government that mints it.

This puts me more to trust Christ. I am bitter about money though in that it makes me a slave, but I take comfort that there is no money in heaven.

Just to note, when God sent manna and quails to Israel for 40 years they did not have to dispense with money, isn't that an amazing thought?

Love Bob

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Bob wrote:Hi Pamela, I am glad you brought up how Jesus never touched money. I believe the reason that was so because money is the mark of the beast, and of course Christ would not take the mark of the beast.

Do I fear then that I will suffer eternal damnation for it? No, for Christ did say everyone, slave free, rich or poor will receive the mark of the beast and will not be able to buy or sell without it. Pretty much sounds like money to me, as currency also bears a seal or a mark to represent the government that mints it.

This puts me more to trust Christ. I am bitter about money though in that it makes me a slave, but I take comfort that there is no money in heaven.
Rev 14:9 And the third angel followed them, saying with a loud voice, If any man worship the beast and his image, and receive [his] mark in his forehead, or in his hand,

Just to note, when God sent manna and quails to Israel for 40 years they did not have to dispense with money, isn't that an amazing thought?

Love Bob

I would expect that it is misadventure to suppose that Jesus never literally touched money...it does not say Jesus went to the bathroom either...I think it is presumptuous to say the mark of the beast is money...

Rev 14:9 And the third angel followed them, saying with a loud voice, If any man worship the beast and his image, and receive [his] mark in his forehead, or in his hand,...

By this you would appear to think thery are going to inscribe a coin in your head... affraid study scratch Suspect Embarassed

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Good WORD... sunny

Here is the definition of J-O-B...the one we work at:

Journey of the Broke. lol! Unless of course, you own the company. Wink

My Boss is a Jewish Carpenter...He has the best incentive plan and benefit package around. All my savings are in heavenly places. I love you

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Susan wrote:Good WORD... sunny

Here is the definition of J-O-B...the one we work at:

Journey of the Broke. lol! Unless of course, you own the company. Wink

My Boss is a Jewish Carpenter...He has the best incentive plan and benefit package around. All my savings are in heavenly places. I love you
My sights are set high, but I am the originator of that infamous bumper sticker..."I Owe I Owe, It's Off To Work I Go!"

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fervent wrote:
Susan wrote:Good WORD... sunny

Here is the definition of J-O-B...the one we work at:

Journey of the Broke. lol! Unless of course, you own the company. Wink

My Boss is a Jewish Carpenter...He has the best incentive plan and benefit package around. All my savings are in heavenly places. I love you
My sights are set high, but I am the originator of that infamous bumper sticker..."I Owe I Owe, It's Off To Work I Go!"

Yes, we still have to pay our way in this ole world... One thing that I understand, is that mankind must work by the sweat of his brow. Let us not labor in vain...

Proverbs 10:16The labour of the righteous tendeth to life: the fruit of the wicked to sin.

The LORD is faithful to meet all our needs according to HIS riches in glory.

Phillipians 4:19 But my God shall supply all your need according to his riches in glory by Christ Jesus.


cheers

Pamela

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Was it you Bob that has posted on the other site, that Jesus had never touched money? I can't recall where I had read that...
Though the question may be, is that why Jesus had Judas carry the money bag? He knew what was in Judas' heart....I don't know but this is not the basis of my post...I am trying to remember why who wrote what...

One of my underlying basis is: To many preachers are preaching prosperity but none are teaching how to be prosperous.


We should as followers of Jesus Christ have all that we NEED. Sometimes I get that confused with what I desire, LOL! But hey, I am a female...J/K...

I often shy away from books that talk about God and money in the same title...My sister asked me if I would read this book with her and see if we can't apply these principles that are scriptually based.

Anyway, when I read the very first sentence of the 1st chapter which is : "Many are teaching my people that they are to prosper but no one is showing them how..."(quote)

When I read that, my mind begins to seek scripture on that...This is where I get stuck on things like this and I can never seem to get past it...The first thing that rolled into my brain was:

Luke 12:25-32
25"And which of you by worrying can add a single hour to his life's span?
26"If then you cannot do even a very little thing, why do you worry about other matters?
27"Consider the lilies, how they grow: they neither toil nor spin; but I tell you, not even Solomon in all his glory clothed himself like one of these.
28"But if God so clothes the grass in the field, which is alive today and tomorrow is thrown into the furnace, how much more will He clothe you? You men of little faith!
29"And do not seek what you will eat and what you will drink, and do not keep worrying.
30"For all these things the nations of the world eagerly seek; but your Father knows that you need these things.
31"But seek His kingdom, and these things will be added to you.
32"Do not be afraid, little flock, for your Father has chosen gladly to give you the kingdom.

I make bold letting the most important key. I ask myself, "Should this not be the ONLY thing we do?" "Isn't this the only thing we should do?" OR "Is there something else I may be missing?"

The mystery continues....

http://awtj.webs.com

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Pamela wrote:Was it you Bob that has posted on the other site, that Jesus had never touched money? I can't recall where I had read that...
Though the question may be, is that why Jesus had Judas carry the money bag? He knew what was in Judas' heart....I don't know but this is not the basis of my post...I am trying to remember why who wrote what...

One of my underlying basis is: To many preachers are preaching prosperity but none are teaching how to be prosperous.


We should as followers of Jesus Christ have all that we NEED. Sometimes I get that confused with what I desire, LOL! But hey, I am a female...J/K...

I often shy away from books that talk about God and money in the same title...My sister asked me if I would read this book with her and see if we can't apply these principles that are scriptually based.

Anyway, when I read the very first sentence of the 1st chapter which is : "Many are teaching my people that they are to prosper but no one is showing them how..."(quote)

When I read that, my mind begins to seek scripture on that...This is where I get stuck on things like this and I can never seem to get past it...The first thing that rolled into my brain was:

Luke 12:25-32
25"And which of you by worrying can add a single hour to his life's span?
26"If then you cannot do even a very little thing, why do you worry about other matters?
27"Consider the lilies, how they grow: they neither toil nor spin; but I tell you, not even Solomon in all his glory clothed himself like one of these.
28"But if God so clothes the grass in the field, which is alive today and tomorrow is thrown into the furnace, how much more will He clothe you? You men of little faith!
29"And do not seek what you will eat and what you will drink, and do not keep worrying.
30"For all these things the nations of the world eagerly seek; but your Father knows that you need these things.
31"But seek His kingdom, and these things will be added to you.
32"Do not be afraid, little flock, for your Father has chosen gladly to give you the kingdom.

I make bold letting the most important key. I ask myself, "Should this not be the ONLY thing we do?" "Isn't this the only thing we should do?" OR "Is there something else I may be missing?"

The mystery continues....

At the end of the day any financial blessing or prosperity is a temporal thing...that also goes for healing of the body...Lazarus got the pleasure of dying twice...

But that does not negate the fact that we are living a life on this earth and we are assured a comfortable time of it as we acknowledge God in our lives. I think Psalms 23 is so important to regard in this...it has said it all really...

Psa 23:1 <A Psalm of David.> The LORD [is] my shepherd; I shall not want. Psa 23:2 He maketh me to lie down in green pastures: he leadeth me beside the still waters. Psa 23:3 He restoreth my soul: he leadeth me in the paths of righteousness for his name's sake. Psa 23:4 Yea, though I walk through the valley of the shadow of death, I will fear no evil: for thou [art] with me; thy rod and thy staff they comfort me. Psa 23:5 Thou preparest a table before me in the presence of mine enemies: thou anointest my head with oil; my cup runneth over. Psa 23:6 Surely goodness and mercy shall follow me all the days of my life: and I will dwell in the house of the LORD for ever.

You quoted this verse among others...31"But seek His kingdom, and these things will be added to you.

That is refering to necessities... ( how much more will He clothe you? You men of little faith! 29"And do not seek what you will eat and what you will drink, and do not keep worrying.)

If this is all there is to the prosperity message most of us can say we have it I think...but I do believe there is more and I know that one has to be rid of the spirit of poverty in order to keep any financial gain...one needs to be taught to think like a millionaire...ever notice guys like Donald Trump who have taken big hits and yet manage to come back to the arena of prosperity? If it works in the world it has to be able to work in the spirit have...I would love to owe the government 100 grand in taxes...because it would mean I have a pile of green...

In closing, you wrote this Pam..."I make bold letting the most important key. I ask myself, "Should this not be the ONLY thing we do?" "Isn't this the only thing we should do?" OR "Is there something else I may be missing?"The mystery continues...."

The first initiative is just that...the promise is like this...say you are heading up a river in a boat and the centre of the channel is the will of God and you are in that place...the wake you leave as you pass spreads outward and backward and let us say there are bouys marking the shallow spots at the edge of the river..these may represent the blessings that you do not aim for on purpose but the wake still touches them..the same sort of event occurs as we serve God... study

Pamela

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That's exactly what this book mentions, "we must get rid of the spirit of poverty in order to move forward into financial gain...He says, that we must change our thinking while in the wilderness before we can enter into the promised land....We can't enter the promised land with old thinking and wilderness thinking...

You must be reading the same book, LOL! Because he also says that a millionaire that goes bankrupt will gain his millions back again, he just knows how to do it...

I am just sitting here! I know that's a blanket statement but on somethings my mind won't wrap around it till I've peeked in all the cracks and crannies....

For a long now I have said over and over to myself, "Seek the Kingdom of Heaven first......" For this is what I believe so strongly....I see what your saying, I even know what your saying...I have just recently experienced what your saying...It's odd sometimes to hear how you have affected someones life path...

http://awtj.webs.com

11default Re: Money! Questions do you have the answers???? on Sun Jun 24, 2007 12:03 am

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A coin inscribe on the head or hand? Haha...but it is not a literal thing like that. I know, I know, it's incredulous to think "if money is the mark of the beast, then I am taking it! Oh my! Surely it is not, Lord..."

I wouldn't put myself up so high.

Christ did say shew me a coin and one was brought to him. I would even believe it was held up to him showing the face of a man inscribed on the coin, so that Christ need not touch the coin. And so the story goes Christ said "Whose face is this?"

"Ceasars"

At which Christ said "then render onto Ceasar what belongs to Ceasar and render onto God what belongs to God."

This is what is said and this is what is meant, for there shall be many who render onto Ceasar all that they have and none onto God. That is how the mark of the beast is borne upon the right hand, in the things we do, or upon the forehead, in the thoughts that we think.

Wealth is a fine thing indeed! To be able to make ends meet and have some left over. Prosperity is truely a blessing and poverty a curse. But, I am where I am because God had taken me there and he shall take me where ever from here. I groan and complain wishing my wealth were in greater folds, and no doubt I believe he hears me, but pray as I may and believe as I may the sky shows no rain. I receive exactly what I need from God, no more no less.

My bills ache me, the luxuries of my friends and family are shown with more than I could have. A nice pair of shoes display's at Niemann Marcus, a fine watch...

As careful as I am with money husbanding every dollar, my balance seems to grow less and less.

I find wishing to God not that I would have more wealth but to leave this maddness, because all the things that I could buy is just dust in the end and I will have nothing anyway.

Money, if you must know, is a spirit out of Babylon, a very old spirit and a seductive one. First, be deprived of money and it is like my lifes blood is drained from me. How can I eat? Where will I sleep? How shall I be clothed? And Christ said only pagans think this way.

But, be awashed in wealth, have the splendor of the finer things and my senses become numb. I will not worry; I can count on my blessings with a fat bank account! Then, I am a fool when my life is deprived, and Christ did say it is easier for a camel to pass through a needle's eye then a rich man to enter Heaven.

See the extremes? And so the spirit of Babylon mocks me grinning like a tempting prostitute saying "how you wish to lay your hand upon me. Perhaps, I will allow it..."

If I think for one second I am above and beyond this because I have God to protect me I invite the true Spirit to test me, and no man can stand up to the Spirit of God and claim to be worthy.

So, I bow low and thank Christ with what he has given me. I trust the Lord let it be done by your will and not mine.

...money is the mark of the beast...

12default Re: Money! Questions do you have the answers???? on Sun Jun 24, 2007 12:11 am

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Bob wrote:A coin inscribe on the head or hand? Haha...but it is not a literal thing like that. I know, I know, it's incredulous to think "if money is the mark of the beast, then I am taking it! Oh my! Surely it is not, Lord..."

I wouldn't put myself up so high.

Christ did say shew me a coin and one was brought to him. I would even believe it was held up to him showing the face of a man inscribed on the coin, so that Christ need not touch the coin. And so the story goes Christ said "Whose face is this?"

"Ceasars"

At which Christ said "then render onto Ceasar what belongs to Ceasar and render onto God what belongs to God."

This is what is said and this is what is meant, for there shall be many who render onto Ceasar all that they have and none onto God. That is how the mark of the beast is borne upon the right hand, in the things we do, or upon the forehead, in the thoughts that we think.

Wealth is a fine thing indeed! To be able to make ends meet and have some left over. Prosperity is truely a blessing and poverty a curse. But, I am where I am because God had taken me there and he shall take me where ever from here. I groan and complain wishing my wealth were in greater folds, and no doubt I believe he hears me, but pray as I may and believe as I may the sky shows no rain. I receive exactly what I need from God, no more no less.

My bills ache me, the luxuries of my friends and family are shown with more than I could have. A nice pair of shoes display's at Niemann Marcus, a fine watch...

As careful as I am with money husbanding every dollar, my balance seems to grow less and less.

I find wishing to God not that I would have more wealth but to leave this maddness, because all the things that I could buy is just dust in the end and I will have nothing anyway.

Money, if you must know, is a spirit out of Babylon, a very old spirit and a seductive one. First, be deprived of money and it is like my lifes blood is drained from me. How can I eat? Where will I sleep? How shall I be clothed? And Christ said only pagans think this way.

But, be awashed in wealth, have the splendor of the finer things and my senses become numb. I will not worry; I can count on my blessings with a fat bank account! Then, I am a fool when my life is deprived, and Christ did say it is easier for a camel to pass through a needle's eye then a rich man to enter Heaven.

See the extremes? And so the spirit of Babylon mocks me grinning like a tempting prostitute saying "how you wish to lay your hand upon me. Perhaps, I will allow it..."

If I think for one second I am above and beyond this because I have God to protect me I invite the true Spirit to test me, and no man can stand up to the Spirit of God and claim to be worthy.

So, I bow low and thank Christ with what he has given me. I trust the Lord let it be done by your will and not mine.

...money is the mark of the beast...

2Co 1:21 Now he which stablisheth us with you in Christ, and hath anointed us, [is] God; 2Co 1:22 Who hath also sealed us, and given the earnest of the Spirit in our hearts.

What is the seal of the Spirit? It is a Spirit induced sound mind will and emotions through the indwelling Spirit of God. What is the mark of the beast? It is a heart sold out to the devil. That is done when one takes on his likeness by choice at the time of the tribualation..it is a spiritual mark not an openly visible mark. It is what the devil has always wanted...men to worship him...it is what he tempted Jesus with during His 40 day fast when He was "led of the Spirit" into the wilderness....

13default Re: Money! Questions do you have the answers???? on Sun Jun 24, 2007 12:22 am

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fervent wrote:
2Co 1:21 Now he which stablisheth us with you in Christ, and hath anointed us, [is] God; 2Co 1:22 Who hath also sealed us, and given the earnest of the Spirit in our hearts.

What is the seal of the Spirit? It is a Spirit induced sound mind will and emotions through the indwelling Spirit of God. What is the mark of the beast? It is a heart sold out to the devil. That is done when one takes on his likeness by choice at the time of the tribualation..it is a spiritual mark not an openly visible mark. It is what the devil has always wanted...men to worship him...it is what he tempted Jesus with during His 40 day fast when He was "led of the Spirit" into the wilderness....

I agree...

But,

Upon every US dollar, however, is a motto "In God We trust"

and upon every US dollar it bears "The Great Seal of the United States of America"

I can understand this in two ways...and one way would want to seduce me away from God.

These things are not coincidence, my friend.

14default Re: Money! Questions do you have the answers???? on Sun Jun 24, 2007 12:25 am

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Bob wrote:
fervent wrote:
2Co 1:21 Now he which stablisheth us with you in Christ, and hath anointed us, [is] God; 2Co 1:22 Who hath also sealed us, and given the earnest of the Spirit in our hearts.

What is the seal of the Spirit? It is a Spirit induced sound mind will and emotions through the indwelling Spirit of God. What is the mark of the beast? It is a heart sold out to the devil. That is done when one takes on his likeness by choice at the time of the tribualation..it is a spiritual mark not an openly visible mark. It is what the devil has always wanted...men to worship him...it is what he tempted Jesus with during His 40 day fast when He was "led of the Spirit" into the wilderness....

I agree...

But,

Upon every US dollar, however, is a motto "In God We trust"

and upon every US dollar it bears "The Great Seal of the United States of America"

I can understand this in two ways...and one way would want to seduce me away from God.

These things are not coincidence, my friend.

All money from all lands have superscriptions...Moslems trust God too..their idea of God...Little of the spiritual realm is observed by outward signs..either demonic or Godly...

2Co 4:3 But if our gospel be hid, it is hid to them that are lost: 2Co 4:4 In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.

Pamela

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HB you just pointed out the reason WHY most believer's ONLY have just what they need and no more....

I quote:
I groan and complain wishing my wealth were in greater folds, and no doubt I believe he hears me, but pray as I may and believe as I may the sky shows no rain. I receive exactly what I need from God, no more no less.

This is the mentalilty that God has to take out of the Israelite in the wilderness. He provided that manna and gave them just what they needed...When they tried to store some for later, it spoiled.


I believe one of the keys to wealth that is received in the promised land is "Being happy with what you have no matter what. Keeping your eyes on what you have and not your neighbors things. And first and foremost never complain at you feel you may lack."

I say that because I say "Who are we to even complain at what we FEEL we lack?" We lack nothing if we trust the Lord God with all our hearts, right? Of course we do....It's that old flesh that wants more to keep up with the Jones'......

I could say, "I lack a limo to take me places." No I don't, Josh drives me everywhere I want to go. Just because it's in a Nissian doesn't make it NOT a limo in my budget...LOL! I could say I am slumming it if I drive my self around....LOL!

I could say, "I lack a maid to clean my home." No I don't I am the maid....

I could say I "I lack a cook to cook my meals." No, I don't I am the cook and on some days Josh will make me breakfast and let me sleep a few more minutes.

I could say, "I want a bank budget to buy whatever I want." I will say, the Lord provides my every need what more could I want....

http://awtj.webs.com

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Pamela wrote:HB you just pointed out the reason WHY most believer's ONLY have just what they need and no more....

I quote:
I groan and complain wishing my wealth were in greater folds, and no doubt I believe he hears me, but pray as I may and believe as I may the sky shows no rain. I receive exactly what I need from God, no more no less.

This is the mentalilty that God has to take out of the Israelite in the wilderness. He provided that manna and gave them just what they needed...When they tried to store some for later, it spoiled.


I believe one of the keys to wealth that is received in the promised land is "Being happy with what you have no matter what. Keeping your eyes on what you have and not your neighbors things. And first and foremost never complain at you feel you may lack."

I say that because I say "Who are we to even complain at what we FEEL we lack?" We lack nothing if we trust the Lord God with all our hearts, right? Of course we do....It's that old flesh that wants more to keep up with the Jones'......

I could say, "I lack a limo to take me places." No I don't, Josh drives me everywhere I want to go. Just because it's in a Nissian doesn't make it NOT a limo in my budget...LOL! I could say I am slumming it if I drive my self around....LOL!

I could say, "I lack a maid to clean my home." No I don't I am the maid....

I could say I "I lack a cook to cook my meals." No, I don't I am the cook and on some days Josh will make me breakfast and let me sleep a few more minutes.

I could say, "I want a bank budget to buy whatever I want." I will say, the Lord provides my every need what more could I want....

Very true! I must act in gratitude with what I have now and not yearn for more. I must give thanks to Christ and be content that God shall provide for all my needs.

Should he increase my wealth it is for his purpose, but in the mean time what I have is enough.

You have a blessed spirit, Pamela.

All money from all lands have superscriptions...Moslems trust God too..their idea of God...Little of the spiritual realm is observed by outward signs..either demonic or Godly...

That is one way to see it, Larry, but the power and influence, the draw and fleshly appeal of money, is from the same unclean spirit that grips many. What Pamela said is the right way, to not desire wealth but to give thanks to God for what I have now. Then if God makes me a wealthy man, I received it by his blessing and not by the other spirit.

I learned quite a bit from the both of you. Thank you!

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Bob wrote:
Pamela wrote:HB you just pointed out the reason WHY most believer's ONLY have just what they need and no more....

I quote:
I groan and complain wishing my wealth were in greater folds, and no doubt I believe he hears me, but pray as I may and believe as I may the sky shows no rain. I receive exactly what I need from God, no more no less.

This is the mentalilty that God has to take out of the Israelite in the wilderness. He provided that manna and gave them just what they needed...When they tried to store some for later, it spoiled.


I believe one of the keys to wealth that is received in the promised land is "Being happy with what you have no matter what. Keeping your eyes on what you have and not your neighbors things. And first and foremost never complain at you feel you may lack."

I say that because I say "Who are we to even complain at what we FEEL we lack?" We lack nothing if we trust the Lord God with all our hearts, right? Of course we do....It's that old flesh that wants more to keep up with the Jones'......

I could say, "I lack a limo to take me places." No I don't, Josh drives me everywhere I want to go. Just because it's in a Nissian doesn't make it NOT a limo in my budget...LOL! I could say I am slumming it if I drive my self around....LOL!

I could say, "I lack a maid to clean my home." No I don't I am the maid....

I could say I "I lack a cook to cook my meals." No, I don't I am the cook and on some days Josh will make me breakfast and let me sleep a few more minutes.

I could say, "I want a bank budget to buy whatever I want." I will say, the Lord provides my every need what more could I want....

Very true! I must act in gratitude with what I have now and not yearn for more. I must give thanks to Christ and be content that God shall provide for all my needs.

Should he increase my wealth it is for his purpose, but in the mean time what I have is enough.

You have a blessed spirit, Pamela.

All money from all lands have superscriptions...Moslems trust God too..their idea of God...Little of the spiritual realm is observed by outward signs..either demonic or Godly...

That is one way to see it, Larry, but the power and influence, the draw and fleshly appeal of money, is from the same unclean spirit that grips many. What Pamela said is the right way, to not desire wealth but to give thanks to God for what I have now. Then if God makes me a wealthy man, I received it by his blessing and not by the other spirit.

I learned quite a bit from the both of you. Thank you!

One needs to further explore a concept..that concept being that God places a "driveness" inside a person for any number of goals and accomplishments....can I tell you having finances for the right reasons is one of those things? I always detect an undercurrent of incredulity that any man who calls himself under the banner of the Lord Jesus Christ is somehow at variance for desiring prosperity...I am not insinuating this with you HB, but it is the blanket (death shroud) of the spirit of religion which is always fear based and sin concious. They overlook a scripture... and a scripture is for living and being and doing...and it addresses finances and wealth in the same momentum...."All things" includes money or else the bible was wrong...

1Ti 6:17 Charge them that are rich in this world, that they be not highminded, nor trust in uncertain riches, but in the living God, who giveth us richly all things to enjoy; 1Ti 6:18 That they do good, that they be rich in good works, ready to distribute, willing to communicate; 1Ti 6:19 Laying up in store for themselves a good foundation against the time to come, that they may lay hold on eternal life.

To me this is saying that Christians who are "rich in this world" are not to get "snobby" about it and to trust in that thing but to trust in God...to prove themselves up by doing the extra giving ..."that they be rich in good works, ready to distribute, willing to communicate;" (KJV English for giving) and in so doing they store up a good foundation in the time to come and they may lay hold of eternal life...it tells me there is an affirmation that riches are "fine and dandy" if used in a proper manner to bless others and to assist in issues where people hurt most...raising the issue also of the wisdom of giving in a way that does not simply enable someone's weakness....

Pamela

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THank you HB....

Fervent you are correct in saying: God places a "driveness" inside a person for any number of goals and accomplishments.

I am living that right now....I am in complete and utter all that the Lord is providing everything we need to build this home community church/outreach center...He gave me the vision 4 years ago and to see it being built and the provisions laid out before us, is amazing and humble to say the least...

This is where my crossroad comes in....I have not changed in work, as a matter of fact, I am making less money because I am now permenately disabled and now drawing SSD which is a small % of my prior paycheck...The Lord though has made it possible for Josh to move up and make more money and all thing balance out...

Through all this we have kept going for the Lord...I don't think that seeking the wealth is the key, this is the point I am getting at in this search to settle it down in my spirit....From what I have experienced no matter what comes down the pike, as long as you keep going, doing the Lord's will/work, HE is faithful. We have to at some point ask ourselves, "What exactly is enough wealth for it to satify a need to where we feel secure?" But yet I answer that question with, "We are not to feel secure in that anyway, it's the Lord we are to be secure in..." It's through His supplication that we will have it....

I close my eyes and picture myself just steadily running along with out fainting and to me this has been a huge key in understanding progession and richness, not in money and wealth, but in the Lord then all my needs are met and I having some left over....

Being rich is money is fine, there is a stigma attached to wealthy people. The more I use our money for the Lord the more blessed we become....I find the more we use our money for worldy uses the less we have...


I am just trying to put all the keys together in my mind....

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19default Re: Money! Questions do you have the answers???? on Sun Jun 24, 2007 10:06 pm

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Pamela wrote:THank you HB....

Fervent you are correct in saying: God places a "driveness" inside a person for any number of goals and accomplishments.

I am living that right now....I am in complete and utter all that the Lord is providing everything we need to build this home community church/outreach center...He gave me the vision 4 years ago and to see it being built and the provisions laid out before us, is amazing and humble to say the least...

This is where my crossroad comes in....I have not changed in work, as a matter of fact, I am making less money because I am now permenately disabled and now drawing SSD which is a small % of my prior paycheck...The Lord though has made it possible for Josh to move up and make more money and all thing balance out...

Through all this we have kept going for the Lord...I don't think that seeking the wealth is the key, this is the point I am getting at in this search to settle it down in my spirit....From what I have experienced no matter what comes down the pike, as long as you keep going, doing the Lord's will/work, HE is faithful. We have to at some point ask ourselves, "What exactly is enough wealth for it to satify a need to where we feel secure?" But yet I answer that question with, "We are not to feel secure in that anyway, it's the Lord we are to be secure in..." It's through His supplication that we will have it....

I close my eyes and picture myself just steadily running along with out fainting and to me this has been a huge key in understanding progession and richness, not in money and wealth, but in the Lord then all my needs are met and I having some left over....

Being rich is money is fine, there is a stigma attached to wealthy people. The more I use our money for the Lord the more blessed we become....I find the more we use our money for worldy uses the less we have...


I am just trying to put all the keys together in my mind....

This is a familar soundtrack...I have rewound that tape many times over the years...it is a testimony in the making...A testimony unfortunately carries with it the caveat that there is first a "test" then an "I" and then a "mony" (moany) If you only knew what I have been through in the living out of my particular promise from God! I have to tell you Pam, that I sense a thing going on here...The Lord is bringing you through a thing and He is showing you His provision, but at the same time He is making you aware that He Himself is that provision...that is where the term "In Christ" has it's roots.... Col 1:17 And he is before all things, and by him all things consist. Today in church my pastor ( a Texan BTW) shared what he called his most important sermon ever...it wraps around the understanding that God is beginning to revitalize His word and He is doing it this way... Luk 24:45 Then opened he their understanding, that they might understand the scriptures... We are going to experience an awakening by the Spirit to be able to assess the written word and to extrapolate greater depth and expound upon revelation...not a new revelation, but deeper understanding on that which we have...the Spirit has been stirring in me more this past three days more than I can remember for several years...I have been consumed with weeping for no apparent reason, (although I do have true peace) even in public places and in prayer...it is one way I experience the close proximity of God...for my flesh becomes undone in that presence...I believe somehow that there is going to be a corporate breakthrough and we will be able to realize more fully that beyond the veil of this life as we look into the spirit realm we will realize that there is more than heaven over there...more than angels and God..there is also a dark force..I tend to think of the spirit world as a place where only God resides...it is funny I never saw the reality before...somehow thinking the devil is in the earth without considering that that whole realm is in the heavenlies and they do work here...

I said all that to say this...there is a time coming the likes of which we would never have dreamed possible...I sense that we are in this together in our unfolding events...I draw quiet faith from our relationship and from what God is doing in your life...for we are embossed by the seal of the Spirit of God and ordained to mighty works in His name.... study :

20default Re: Money! Questions do you have the answers???? on Sun Jun 24, 2007 10:45 pm

Pamela

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Yes, I agree Fervent....

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21default Re: Money! Questions do you have the answers???? on Sun Jun 24, 2007 10:53 pm

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Oh, but I do desire prosperity. My lesson is that it must not be for the wrong reasons. I've felt I've learned that lesson many times over and then when think I can achieve my hope I am thrust into a deeper understanding that shows me how wrong I was.

Now I am still. It is a death of a thing perhaps hope, but not in Christ. I had a massive sense of bitterness about the whole thing and I've placed it on his altar. It is my offering to God because if I hold onto it it would forment as resentment and eat me alive.

The amazing thing is God would take this from me. Bitterness curses, shame and confession. Rather than my promise to feed the poor or shelter the homeless or any expression of philanthropy he would want my bitterness first.

It's as if I had a store full of many things and God would stroll through my things asking for the lowest, darkest piece of junk in me.

"That??? Uh, honestly, I thought I got rid of it. I tried to hide it...you really want that, God? Okay it is yours."

...and I thought he wanted jewels and gems from me, go figure.

But...

it breaks me even more as I cannot understand how God is the most loving and gracious force I've experienced! To take the worst element out of me leaving a hole big enough to toss a cat through it! Though, the hole in me is covered by his loving hand and I am left for no want but of Christ!

22default Re: Money! Questions do you have the answers???? on Sun Jun 24, 2007 11:28 pm

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Bob wrote:Oh, but I do desire prosperity. My lesson is that it must not be for the wrong reasons. I've felt I've learned that lesson many times over and then when think I can achieve my hope I am thrust into a deeper understanding that shows me how wrong I was.

Now I am still. It is a death of a thing perhaps hope, but not in Christ. I had a massive sense of bitterness about the whole thing and I've placed it on his altar. It is my offering to God because if I hold onto it it would forment as resentment and eat me alive.

The amazing thing is God would take this from me. Bitterness curses, shame and confession. Rather than my promise to feed the poor or shelter the homeless or any expression of philanthropy he would want my bitterness first.

It's as if I had a store full of many things and God would stroll through my things asking for the lowest, darkest piece of junk in me.

"That??? Uh, honestly, I thought I got rid of it. I tried to hide it...you really want that, God? Okay it is yours."

...and I thought he wanted jewels and gems from me, go figure.

But...

it breaks me even more as I cannot understand how God is the most loving and gracious force I've experienced! To take the worst element out of me leaving a hole big enough to toss a cat through it! Though, the hole in me is covered by his loving hand and I am left for no want but of Christ!
Hello Bob..the thing I love about you is your candor as you walk out the issues of life...it is rare to see such inner reflection worn as an outer garment that has a border of praise woven into it...in your integrity of heart to see the will of the Lord performed, there is such selflessness that it makes me weep....you are a unique individual...we can learn from you in the secret place as we ingest the words you write.. flower study

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Do you desire what this world has to offer or what the LORD offer's? I think this question's answer may give you some food for thought.

Pamela

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Those things we can see are only temporary....So money is only for a fleeting moment...

It is those things we cannot see are for eternity....Those are the riches I want...


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